<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	xmlns:series="http://unfoldingneurons.com/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The myth about the standard user in Windows Vista and Windows 7</title>
	<atom:link href="http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/</link>
	<description>For Windows Administrators</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 16:01:54 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=abc</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Michael Pietroforte</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-128037</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Pietroforte</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jun 2009 20:14:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-128037</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s one reason why I encrypt all my personal files. So just in case my laptop ever needs a repair, I won&#039;t have to worry. Confidential data is certainly an issue when it comes to Internet-based apps. But I believe in the long run encryption technology will solve this problem.

As I outlined in the article, in Vista apps run with standard rights, but most end users still have admin privileges. With RIAs or virtualized apps this is not necessary anymore because they don&#039;t have to be installed.

As to the dinosaurs, they ruled the planet for several million years. So don&#039;t expect the Microsofties to die out any time soon. ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s one reason why I encrypt all my personal files. So just in case my laptop ever needs a repair, I won&#8217;t have to worry. Confidential data is certainly an issue when it comes to Internet-based apps. But I believe in the long run encryption technology will solve this problem.</p>
<p>As I outlined in the article, in Vista apps run with standard rights, but most end users still have admin privileges. With RIAs or virtualized apps this is not necessary anymore because they don&#8217;t have to be installed.</p>
<p>As to the dinosaurs, they ruled the planet for several million years. So don&#8217;t expect the Microsofties to die out any time soon. <img src='http://4sysops.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Stefan</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-128034</link>
		<dc:creator>Stefan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jun 2009 15:33:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-128034</guid>
		<description>No, I do not know the people who fix my car, therefore i remove all my personal belongings (data) BEFORE they get the car.
I would do the same the with rich internet applications, but what is the purpose of a application without data.

The fact that a programm don&#039;t has to be installed into the system (instead only executed) do not make them secure by design. If a ria only runs in my home directory what is the advantage compared to other &quot;portable&quot; programs (execept the speed i guess)?
If the &quot;only difference [..] is that they can’t change the OS&quot; why is it a new era?

Today (microsoft finally archived that, more or less) every program runs as unpriviledged user, except the stuff that needs direct access to hardware like the GUI of the OS. You only need administrative right for permanent changes on the system (copying files into your system-dirs, for other users, and to set global registry keys). 

What has windows to do with ria&#039;s??? They run in the browser, thats an application not an operating systems. You can use activeX, flash, javascript, java and google gears today, what is missing?
Do not expect the big animal to make big jumps and remember what happened with the big dinosaur animals once. They were to slow to adapt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, I do not know the people who fix my car, therefore i remove all my personal belongings (data) BEFORE they get the car.<br />
I would do the same the with rich internet applications, but what is the purpose of a application without data.</p>
<p>The fact that a programm don&#8217;t has to be installed into the system (instead only executed) do not make them secure by design. If a ria only runs in my home directory what is the advantage compared to other &#8220;portable&#8221; programs (execept the speed i guess)?<br />
If the &#8220;only difference [..] is that they can’t change the OS&#8221; why is it a new era?</p>
<p>Today (microsoft finally archived that, more or less) every program runs as unpriviledged user, except the stuff that needs direct access to hardware like the GUI of the OS. You only need administrative right for permanent changes on the system (copying files into your system-dirs, for other users, and to set global registry keys). </p>
<p>What has windows to do with ria&#8217;s??? They run in the browser, thats an application not an operating systems. You can use activeX, flash, javascript, java and google gears today, what is missing?<br />
Do not expect the big animal to make big jumps and remember what happened with the big dinosaur animals once. They were to slow to adapt.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Michael Pietroforte</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-128009</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Pietroforte</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 09:51:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-128009</guid>
		<description>Err, Do you know the people who fix your car? Does the government do this for you?

Stefan, the Internet allows you to launch applications without installing them. Application virtualization and Rich Internet Apps made this possible. I guess in 99% of all cases when an end user requires admin privileges, he or she installs software. If software doesn&#039;t have to be installed anymore, then end users won&#039;t require admin privileges. I agree that Microsoft is often slow. This is just because they are big. Big animals move slow. But that isn&#039;t really a problem because their size helps them to survive. However, I am quite sure that the change I outlined in the article will come sooner rather than later.

Hi Leonardo, so you are back to Brazil now? Lucky you! I think a 1Mbit connection is fast enough for this technology. The application has to be downloaded only once. It stays on the PC in the cache until it has to be updated. The only difference to old fashioned Windows apps is that they can&#039;t change the OS or other applications by design. Thus if you can run Windows apps in Brazil, then you can also run Rich Internet apps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Err, Do you know the people who fix your car? Does the government do this for you?</p>
<p>Stefan, the Internet allows you to launch applications without installing them. Application virtualization and Rich Internet Apps made this possible. I guess in 99% of all cases when an end user requires admin privileges, he or she installs software. If software doesn&#8217;t have to be installed anymore, then end users won&#8217;t require admin privileges. I agree that Microsoft is often slow. This is just because they are big. Big animals move slow. But that isn&#8217;t really a problem because their size helps them to survive. However, I am quite sure that the change I outlined in the article will come sooner rather than later.</p>
<p>Hi Leonardo, so you are back to Brazil now? Lucky you! I think a 1Mbit connection is fast enough for this technology. The application has to be downloaded only once. It stays on the PC in the cache until it has to be updated. The only difference to old fashioned Windows apps is that they can&#8217;t change the OS or other applications by design. Thus if you can run Windows apps in Brazil, then you can also run Rich Internet apps.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Leonardo</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-127913</link>
		<dc:creator>Leonardo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 16:03:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-127913</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t have much of an opinion on UAC... It is what it is. If it causes trouble for an application/user, then I have to disable it.

I do have beef with the Internet delivery thing... Why? I&#039;m currently working off a 256kbit connection, the max connection available to me is 1Mbit.
How can I use cloud apps and still download my por- err, technical PDFs/look up Kbase articles and stream my right-wing propaganda all at the same time?

I guess cloud apps can be rolled out in industrialized countries 1st. I&#039;ll skip it until I&#039;m too senile to work.

Greets from Brazil.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t have much of an opinion on UAC&#8230; It is what it is. If it causes trouble for an application/user, then I have to disable it.</p>
<p>I do have beef with the Internet delivery thing&#8230; Why? I&#8217;m currently working off a 256kbit connection, the max connection available to me is 1Mbit.<br />
How can I use cloud apps and still download my por- err, technical PDFs/look up Kbase articles and stream my right-wing propaganda all at the same time?</p>
<p>I guess cloud apps can be rolled out in industrialized countries 1st. I&#8217;ll skip it until I&#8217;m too senile to work.</p>
<p>Greets from Brazil.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Stefan</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-127797</link>
		<dc:creator>Stefan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 May 2009 18:48:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-127797</guid>
		<description>What did the internet changed for the need end-user administration? I administrate my network/computers via remote access (call it &quot;internet&quot;) but i&#039;am needed (as an administrator) anyway.

face new problems:
1. If the user doesn´t manage their system who does? Microsoft?
2. If the user want to make a change which requires administrative rights (like installing software) you have to grant him this right. Even if the software is a virus/trojan: How can you tell (except with a virus scanner which can be wrong or insecure itself)?

...so what changes with a cloud (or: Why hasn&#039;t the user waited for this?):
1. You give up the control of your computer a rely on hosted application of a 3rd party. THEY will have the same security problems but maybe (hopefully) they will do it better.
2. if they die (in the next crisis), your application dies too. 
3. you are limited to permanent connection (speed?) but technologies like google gears might solve this to a certain point.
4. the service will cost money on a monthly basis or ads will &quot;entertain&quot; your work.

All these advantages (disadvantages for users) convinced most of the (even not fresh and hype) companies to make you an offer.
Sun declared in the late 70s &quot;The network is the computer&quot;, the cloud hype cooked up (again) this old dream, but the truth is: it isn&#039;t the time (yet?).
Why?
1. computer are cheap for you and me, but not for everyone (think of &quot;one laptop per child&quot; initiatives)
2. you don&#039;t have internet access everywhere (not even in cities)
3. the connection is slow (upload!)
4. people are not used to the idea (habit is slow) in general
5. and especially not to give 3rd parties access to private data (except exhibitionist blogges of course) which doesn&#039;t fall under privacy laws of your country (a lot of people fear google apps).

When was microsoft ever fast? They feed the cash-cow enough to stay alive, but nothing more. If you want fast and user-friendly changes: not gonna happen, change the plattform.
Maybe at 50% market-share they understand. Remember when they kept telling people that Vista is the best windows ever (a real success)? I think they believed it, they really couldn&#039;t understand what someone could criticize on Vista.

St</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What did the internet changed for the need end-user administration? I administrate my network/computers via remote access (call it &#8220;internet&#8221;) but i&#8217;am needed (as an administrator) anyway.</p>
<p>face new problems:<br />
1. If the user doesn´t manage their system who does? Microsoft?<br />
2. If the user want to make a change which requires administrative rights (like installing software) you have to grant him this right. Even if the software is a virus/trojan: How can you tell (except with a virus scanner which can be wrong or insecure itself)?</p>
<p>&#8230;so what changes with a cloud (or: Why hasn&#8217;t the user waited for this?):<br />
1. You give up the control of your computer a rely on hosted application of a 3rd party. THEY will have the same security problems but maybe (hopefully) they will do it better.<br />
2. if they die (in the next crisis), your application dies too.<br />
3. you are limited to permanent connection (speed?) but technologies like google gears might solve this to a certain point.<br />
4. the service will cost money on a monthly basis or ads will &#8220;entertain&#8221; your work.</p>
<p>All these advantages (disadvantages for users) convinced most of the (even not fresh and hype) companies to make you an offer.<br />
Sun declared in the late 70s &#8220;The network is the computer&#8221;, the cloud hype cooked up (again) this old dream, but the truth is: it isn&#8217;t the time (yet?).<br />
Why?<br />
1. computer are cheap for you and me, but not for everyone (think of &#8220;one laptop per child&#8221; initiatives)<br />
2. you don&#8217;t have internet access everywhere (not even in cities)<br />
3. the connection is slow (upload!)<br />
4. people are not used to the idea (habit is slow) in general<br />
5. and especially not to give 3rd parties access to private data (except exhibitionist blogges of course) which doesn&#8217;t fall under privacy laws of your country (a lot of people fear google apps).</p>
<p>When was microsoft ever fast? They feed the cash-cow enough to stay alive, but nothing more. If you want fast and user-friendly changes: not gonna happen, change the plattform.<br />
Maybe at 50% market-share they understand. Remember when they kept telling people that Vista is the best windows ever (a real success)? I think they believed it, they really couldn&#8217;t understand what someone could criticize on Vista.</p>
<p>St</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Err</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-127806</link>
		<dc:creator>Err</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 May 2009 01:22:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-127806</guid>
		<description>Letting people i dont know administer the computer?
Ok at work, but at home? Let the government take care of our computer habits? Jesus..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Letting people i dont know administer the computer?<br />
Ok at work, but at home? Let the government take care of our computer habits? Jesus..</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Michael Pietroforte</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-127777</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Pietroforte</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 21:07:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-127777</guid>
		<description>Of course, no system administers itself. But who says that end users have to manage their systems? My point is that thanks to the Internet  this is not necessary anymore. Security is not really a technical problem, it is mostly a user problem. As long as non-computer savvy people have rights on their computers which they don&#039;t deserve, hackers will have an easy win. This wouldn&#039;t be different with any other operating system. Therefore, Microsoft doesn&#039;t have to change the core architecture of Windows to get a secure system. They only have to make sure that end users can do everything they want without requiring administrator privileges. And this starts with giving up the idea that applications have to be installed on desktop computers. I am pretty sure that in the future applications will only be launched, i.e. downloaded an started. The part of the application that has to be managed will run in the cloud. The rich user interface runs on the fat client. It is already doable today. Microsoft is just too slow to adopt this new desktop model.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, no system administers itself. But who says that end users have to manage their systems? My point is that thanks to the Internet  this is not necessary anymore. Security is not really a technical problem, it is mostly a user problem. As long as non-computer savvy people have rights on their computers which they don&#8217;t deserve, hackers will have an easy win. This wouldn&#8217;t be different with any other operating system. Therefore, Microsoft doesn&#8217;t have to change the core architecture of Windows to get a secure system. They only have to make sure that end users can do everything they want without requiring administrator privileges. And this starts with giving up the idea that applications have to be installed on desktop computers. I am pretty sure that in the future applications will only be launched, i.e. downloaded an started. The part of the application that has to be managed will run in the cloud. The rich user interface runs on the fat client. It is already doable today. Microsoft is just too slow to adopt this new desktop model.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Stefan</title>
		<link>http://4sysops.com/archives/the-myth-about-the-standard-user-in-windows-vista-and-windows-7/comment-page-1/#comment-127682</link>
		<dc:creator>Stefan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 17:52:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://4sysops.com/?p=2852#comment-127682</guid>
		<description>The &quot;outdated desktop model&quot; is the least of microsofts problems. No system does administer itself especially not windows. The inability to change the rotten core (archecture) of windows due to maintain compatibility (and keep customer) forces microsoft to make cosmetic changes on the surface.

UAC is the forced &quot;solution&quot; for programs in userland that are designed to run as admin. Why had so many programs problems? Well, there wasn&#039;t a useable standard (restricted) user before Vista, therefore no customer did it, therefore no one complained. Microsofts lazy guidelines were just paper.

Even Microsoft didn&#039;t care, they ran all services as &quot;system&quot;-user up to Windows XP and got hit by many worms.
By the way: Have you ever wondered why the percentage of critical (security) updates is so high? Right, too much code runs as admin/in kernel space, which is far too big anyway compared to other OS.
A full rewrite of windows is too expensive (ask shareholders about that idea + see what happened with longhorn) so don&#039;t expect any miracles in the future.

Just remember: Wait for the next release (which is the best and safest of all windows releases ever, as usual,) and hope they make their homework. You know the saying: Hope dies last, mine died with every windows release again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8220;outdated desktop model&#8221; is the least of microsofts problems. No system does administer itself especially not windows. The inability to change the rotten core (archecture) of windows due to maintain compatibility (and keep customer) forces microsoft to make cosmetic changes on the surface.</p>
<p>UAC is the forced &#8220;solution&#8221; for programs in userland that are designed to run as admin. Why had so many programs problems? Well, there wasn&#8217;t a useable standard (restricted) user before Vista, therefore no customer did it, therefore no one complained. Microsofts lazy guidelines were just paper.</p>
<p>Even Microsoft didn&#8217;t care, they ran all services as &#8220;system&#8221;-user up to Windows XP and got hit by many worms.<br />
By the way: Have you ever wondered why the percentage of critical (security) updates is so high? Right, too much code runs as admin/in kernel space, which is far too big anyway compared to other OS.<br />
A full rewrite of windows is too expensive (ask shareholders about that idea + see what happened with longhorn) so don&#8217;t expect any miracles in the future.</p>
<p>Just remember: Wait for the next release (which is the best and safest of all windows releases ever, as usual,) and hope they make their homework. You know the saying: Hope dies last, mine died with every windows release again.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
